Malin, as someone playing the pipes in this show with a new sort of energy and style, I wonder if you find there’s a tension between what the audience expects to hear and see versus what they will experience? Are we tapping into the stereotypical piping we hear on the Royal Mile in Edinburgh?
Malin: I think we’ve travelled through all those iterations. I think the place we’ve gotten to is beyond that, I hope. For me my main journey has been through piobaireachd, the old style of bagpiping pre-Victorians. For me the codification comes from that Victorian-era, military bagpiping which was only invented in the mid 1800s. A lot of my own work is about what was before that, it was a lot more free and less rigid and militarised. When it comes to the show the opening piece is a techno track with pipes in it. Using the pipes in a way you would a lead synth in dance music.
The interesting thing working with Charlotte and Jack as well is that they’re so in touch with the way they move, they’re so aware of the tiny things, I have not spent as many years doing that so I kind of take it for granted, how I arrive is just to do the thing. Charlotte and Jack were great at looking at what I was doing, specific arm movements, we broke it down to the movement of how a body engages with an instrument. That was fascinating to look at. Looking at the instrument as a prop removed from the body.
Was it a challenge finding a new language with each other from these codified forms? Was it all just playing?
Jack: I think both. I found a challenge in the early stages was that as soon as you start messing around or experiment with the form of Irish Dancing it can so easily tip over into feeling like you’re taking the piss. And that's not what I’m trying to do. I suppose that's a symptom of training in a tradition where there’s a clear right or wrong of doing things.
Charlotte: I have been trying for a while since graduating from the London Contemporary Dance School to try and merge Highland and contemporary as one. I hadn’t really felt like I succeeded doing that until I heard Malin’s music. Malin was doing something similar to me, they had these traditions in their body and knew how to take them forward or make it honest to themself. The moment I can sit in the exploration of Highland/Contemporary is when Malin and I have a bit of a Burns supper moment. Malin does this piping to fit that vibe but I’m also playing myself as a ten year old doing these Burns suppers and me as an adult now. It’s quite tied to emotion as well, I had never experienced the hold of what I was held with which were these really horrific Highland pipes [laughs]. In games halls, gym halls, outside in the rain. I would go home and be lying in bed after a competition and just have these piping sounds in the head! But with Malin’s music it's being held in a different and safe way. We have a deeper understanding of the work and where we are at now. I can merge different selves.
Malin: I think there was tension in doing the obvious and what actually interested us. The challenge wasn’t just chucking these three things together but also feeling it in an authentic way within ourselves. Musically it was hard not to do anything show-offy. [Laughs.]
Jack: I think that was true for all of us! It just can’t be helped.
Malin: The traditions we are in are very showy, the competition aspect is about being the best. Doing the hardest thing and nailing it. How do we—in a body centred, anti-establishment, anti-colonial way —want to be good without it being about looking good. It’s doing our things in a softer way. The balance between hard and soft, pain and joy. Movement and music that is cutting rather than having space, with the pipes there is no space. It's constant and loud and in your face! How do we do something unexpected with it? Similarly Jack takes a style that is so vertical and becomes this sort of horizontal being—it's incredible to see. That click of finding the softness was when we really clicked and found what was missing for us: a connection with our traditions that we never had. Also bringing three techniques that are usually solitary and finding a collaborative aspect.
Jack: I find it interesting that the techniques we come from are so individual. It’s so contrary to what folk dance and folk music is about.
Charlotte: The show is also looking at bringing our full self into the room, however it is that day, and feeling welcome. The word earnest comes in, we spoke a lot about earnestness throughout the process.
How important is it to actually loosen things up? To bring traditions to a less serious place?
Charlotte: For me at least that's a very important element of the show. Honouring the traditions, not taking the mick out of it. Being earnest in what we’re trying to achieve. But there’s also an irony in having this in a show called “not for glory” as wanting to just do our best and have fun. Not caring about five star reviews (but secretly loving that). The pull between the serious and the silly. The ridiculousness of pride in oneself and one's country. We’re very lucky that we all grew up in Scotland but it also has a complex history of belonging.
Jack: It feels like there’s a wave at the minute of bringing more traditional things into mainstream or popular culture but in a way that's more politically aware. More edgy and more challenging than previous waves of Gaelic revival. I hope in some way we’re contributing to that and bringing traditions into spaces that they weren’t previously invited to while asking questions of them and with them.
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